So, how'd that engine mod work out for you?

[Valiant]

I totally agree with the "sketchy" Asian customer service on performance parts.
I can't say I trust Yuminashi stuff/customer service, however all my Yuminashi parts are doing fine (knock on wood).

But i'm all for Valiant being the guinea pig on a 196 big bore kit sounds awesome.
Until then I'm much more leaning towards a engine swap... probably a forza 300 with pod filter, custom exhaust and Dr.p sliders only.

Actually, more on this:
It seems Yuminashi has a bit of a history on the Honda Grom forums with regards to the testing of his new products. Namely, his customers basically compose the QC department . Oh, and it seems slow communications(or non-existent ones) are not unheard of. On the other hand, there was one guy who claims that he blew up 3 engines with a Takegawa BBK , though he admits he was pushing it damned hard.

I'm currently looking at what Roman from rzracing has to offer with his own in-house BBK(his 190 kit is 2000 euros, so I'm looking at the 175), though I'd still need the Yuminashi parts(namely the intake manifold and injector) to run it properly.

[Pcxdemon]

I totally agree with the "sketchy" Asian customer service on performance parts.
I can't say I trust Yuminashi stuff/customer service, however all my Yuminashi parts are doing fine (knock on wood).

But i'm all for Valiant being the guinea pig on a 196 big bore kit sounds awesome.
Until then I'm much more leaning towards a engine swap... probably a forza 300 with pod filter, custom exhaust and Dr.p sliders only.

Actually, more on this:
It seems Yuminashi has a bit of a history on the Honda Grom forums with regards to the testing of his new products. Namely, his customers basically compose the QC department . Oh, and it seems slow communications(or non-existent ones) are not unheard of. On the other hand, there was one guy who claims that he blew up 3 engines with a Takegawa BBK , though he admits he was pushing it damned hard.

I'm currently looking at what Roman from rzracing has to offer with his own in-house BBK(his 190 kit is 2000 euros, so I'm looking at the 175), though I'd still need the Yuminashi parts(namely the intake manifold and injector) to run it properly.

I think but im not 100% certain but fell like 99% that Roman's 190kit is Yuminashi made.
I've just talked to Reggy via Facebook, he has been busy tuning the 190/196cc kits of lately and doing other projects so he didn't have much time to spend on the net plus having a holidays as well..

[Valiant]

I think but im not 100% certain but fell like 99% that Roman's 190kit is Yuminashi made.

So... same quality?

I've just talked to Reggy via Facebook, he has been busy tuning the 190/196cc kits of lately and doing other projects so he didn't have much time to spend on the net plus having a holidays as well..

Understandable, though I would think it worth the time to put a notice regarding the holiday leave time, particularly if your online store is still open and accepting transactions, especially if a customer already shelled out $1,150.49 on an experimental 196cc Big Bore kit.

I can see new products up on the direct sales website in the past 48 hours, but I still feel like I should wait until I get a response before actually giving a single dime to them. I toyed with the idea of buying something cheap and seeing if it ships, but evidently even the small plastic intake tube costs $50+ to ship internationally via Fed Ex, so I suspect anything will cost an arm and a leg to ship. Thus, it's all the more important for me to actually be sure they'll ship it out in a timely fashion.

Personally I would prefer to get Yuminashi's 175cc kit, as it should still use the single layer gasket compared to Roman's triple layer gasket. Though I'm not sure how big a deal that is given that webike does seem to have the spares available for order for the Takegawa 170cc kit. I might check with my scooter shop to see how much time/money it costs to replace the cylinder head gaskets. I've been riding(again) since October, and I have yet to reach 1,100 miles, even while riding around from town to town for giggles. Still don't have the bladder and bowel fortitude for an island round trip.

The Takegawa kit seems a bit more cost economical and doesn't require the Bazzaz combo to compensate for the fuel mix, though in all fairness I'm not 100% sure how long it would go before something in the engine breaks.

[Mel46]

$1100 for a kit for our little pcx 150s?? You can buy a 2013 version of our bikes for just over twice that amount. Before i would spend that much on an upgrade kit i would want to know that it was worth it. I paid around $4000 OTD for my little pcx. Add $1100 to that and i could have purchased a Forza. So, before i would add the $1100 BBK i would try the NCY variator and drive face to get some more out of my bike. I'm pretty sure that would only cost my a little over $100.

[Valiant]

$1100 for a kit for our little pcx 150s?? You can buy a 2013 version of our bikes for just over twice that amount. Before i would spend that much on an upgrade kit i would want to know that it was worth it. I paid around $4000 OTD for my little pcx. Add $1100 to that and i could have purchased a Forza. So, before i would add the $1100 BBK i would try the NCY variator and drive face to get some more out of my bike. I'm pretty sure that would only cost my a little over $100.

Here's the thing Mel, the variator and drive face might get you a little more top end, but it won't do much to get you there if your PCX already had problems actually getting you to the top end(either because of wind drag, uphill, rider weight, etc).

Once the belt locks out(around 50-55mph), acceleration will essentially flatten out and only crawl upwards. I then have to accept the fact that screwing with the engine is the only way to get anything more out of it.

As well, my parking spot is in front of that stall(so the PCX sits sideways), and it barely fits as it is:


Though I'm probably more likely to go with the 175cc kit for a cheaper install job, plus less of the "experimental" factor.

[you you]

I think but im not 100% certain but fell like 99% that Roman's 190kit is Yuminashi made.

So... same quality?

I've just talked to Reggy via Facebook, he has been busy tuning the 190/196cc kits of lately and doing other projects so he didn't have much time to spend on the net plus having a holidays as well..

Understandable, though I would think it worth the time to put a notice regarding the holiday leave time, particularly if your online store is still open and accepting transactions, especially if a customer already shelled out $1,150.49 on an experimental 196cc Big Bore kit.

I can see new products up on the direct sales website in the past 48 hours, but I still feel like I should wait until I get a response before actually giving a single dime to them. I toyed with the idea of buying something cheap and seeing if it ships, but evidently even the small plastic intake tube costs $50+ to ship internationally via Fed Ex, so I suspect anything will cost an arm and a leg to ship. Thus, it's all the more important for me to actually be sure they'll ship it out in a timely fashion.

Personally I would prefer to get Yuminashi's 175cc kit, as it should still use the single layer gasket compared to Roman's triple layer gasket. Though I'm not sure how big a deal that is given that webike does seem to have the spares available for order for the Takegawa 170cc kit. I might check with my scooter shop to see how much time/money it costs to replace the cylinder head gaskets. I've been riding(again) since October, and I have yet to reach 1,100 miles, even while riding around from town to town for giggles. Still don't have the bladder and bowel fortitude for an island round trip.

The Takegawa kit seems a bit more cost economical and doesn't require the Bazzaz combo to compensate for the fuel mix, though in all fairness I'm not 100% sure how long it would go before something in the engine breaks.

Perhaps leave it alone and just ride it?

[Valiant]

Perhaps leave it alone and just ride it?

Riiiight, we're all here in this "Performance" section because we all want to leave our PCX alone and just ride it as it is .

[Pcxdemon]

From my vast experience regarding fuelling issues that everyone talks about, there is none!
What ever big bore kit you get you will need just a bigger fuel injector, yuminashi just brought one out that will fuel 196cc kit without the need for piggy back units.
Also there is an option like I am using and roman did as well, we use the current bigger injector (not the latest version big injector) and it is super fine to go along the big bore kit( no stroker crank). It fuels at 13 to 13.5 afr full throttle acelaration with the lot set up I have. By using Takegawa ficon (which is really simple to hook up and use) I have lowered my afr on wot down to 12- 12.3 by simply selecting basic 125 program but with performance exhaust. Same scenario is achievable with kitaco fuel controler but it's a bit more complex to install as it needs wires cut and reconnected..this last scenario was tested by roman on a 175 build and dyno tested, perfect! So no need for bazzaz fuel controllers and dyno sessions..it's all already been done and proven good by doing many many miles and years by now.

[Valiant]

From my vast experience regarding fuelling issues that everyone talks about, there is none!
What ever big bore kit you get you will need just a bigger fuel injector, yuminashi just brought one out that will fuel 196cc kit without the need for piggy back units.

Kind of why I was interested in a full Yuminashi set.

Also there is an option like I am using and roman did as well, we use the current bigger injector (not the latest version big injector) and it is super fine to go along the big bore kit( no stroker crank). It fuels at 13 to 13.5 afr full throttle acelaration with the lot set up I have. By using Takegawa ficon (which is really simple to hook up and use) I have lowered my afr on wot down to 12- 12.3 by simply selecting basic 125 program but with performance exhaust. Same scenario is achievable with kitaco fuel controler but it's a bit more complex to install as it needs wires cut and reconnected..this last scenario was tested by roman on a 175 build and dyno tested, perfect! So no need for bazzaz fuel controllers and dyno sessions..it's all already been done and proven good by doing many many miles and years by now.

Would the FiCon2 or i-Map allow you to set variable AFR depending on the throttle? Say maybe the stock 14.7 up to about 40% throttle, 13.5 from 40%-80%, and 12.3 from 80%-100%? I figure it would be more sensible, giving you fuel economy for street driving, and power when you need it.

Does a preset map achieve that? I figure there might be a few money wrenches thrown in if you guys use a different product combination than I did.

[Pcxdemon]

From my vast experience regarding fuelling issues that everyone talks about, there is none!
What ever big bore kit you get you will need just a bigger fuel injector, yuminashi just brought one out that will fuel 196cc kit without the need for piggy back units.

Kind of why I was interested in a full Yuminashi set.

Also there is an option like I am using and roman did as well, we use the current bigger injector (not the latest version big injector) and it is super fine to go along the big bore kit( no stroker crank). It fuels at 13 to 13.5 afr full throttle acelaration with the lot set up I have. By using Takegawa ficon (which is really simple to hook up and use) I have lowered my afr on wot down to 12- 12.3 by simply selecting basic 125 program but with performance exhaust. Same scenario is achievable with kitaco fuel controler but it's a bit more complex to install as it needs wires cut and reconnected..this last scenario was tested by roman on a 175 build and dyno tested, perfect! So no need for bazzaz fuel controllers and dyno sessions..it's all already been done and proven good by doing many many miles and years by now.

Would the FiCon2 or i-Map allow you to set variable AFR depending on the throttle? Say maybe the stock 14.7 up to about 40% throttle, 13.5 from 40%-80%, and 12.3 from 80%-100%? I figure it would be more sensible, giving you fuel economy for street driving, and power when you need it.

Does a preset map achieve that? I figure there might be a few money wrenches thrown in if you guys use a different product combination than I did.

That's how I get it atm..I only get 12afr with wot otherwise keeps it around 13.5 and 15.
Kitaco is fully editable with mapping. It has a graph with afr values for tp and rpm and rev limit delete.
There are few others on webike that are like that and better. There is one that will pair via Bluetooth with your phone or lap top and you can edit while on the go..

[Valiant]

That's how I get it atm..I only get 12afr with wot otherwise keeps it around 13.5 and 15.
Kitaco is fully editable with mapping. It has a graph with afr values for tp and rpm and rev limit delete.
There are few others on webike that are like that and better. There is one that will pair via Bluetooth with your phone or lap top and you can edit while on the go..

Sounds juicy . Though I hope the rev limit delete is an optional feature, as the last thing I need is to blow up my engine . I would assume the other units aren't specifically meant for the PCX like the FiCon2, i-Map, and Bazzaz are.

In any case, I shot Roman an e-mail asking about his proposed 175cc set for me, as this non-response by Yuminashi is aggravating.

[Pcxdemon]

That's how I get it atm..I only get 12afr with wot otherwise keeps it around 13.5 and 15.
Kitaco is fully editable with mapping. It has a graph with afr values for tp and rpm and rev limit delete.
There are few others on webike that are like that and better. There is one that will pair via Bluetooth with your phone or lap top and you can edit while on the go..

Sounds juicy . Though I hope the rev limit delete is an optional feature, as the last thing I need is to blow up my engine . I would assume the other units aren't specifically meant for the PCX like the FiCon2, i-Map, and Bazzaz are.

In any case, I shot Roman an e-mail asking about his proposed 175cc set for me, as this non-response by Yuminashi is aggravating.

Sorry, kitaco rev limit is not delete, it's editable so you can raise, lower in 500rpm increments or leave it as it is..I'd just go with Takegawa ficon as it's much more simpler to install than kitaco but you won't really need either if you just get the latest big injector. Even I don't need it as there is not much difference between running my injector alone at 13.5afr wot and using ficon to drop it to 12afr wot. I can't feel any diff in performance and 13.5 wit afr is not that bad at all. I just can't be bothered to pull it out so it's in there now..

[Valiant]

Hmm, having a simpler install would do wonders for me.

I assume this is the Bluetooth EFI you were talking about:
http://japan.webike.net/products/21816954.html

Seems cool, though I would hope the app language actually has readable English.

[Valiant]

Sorry, kitaco rev limit is not delete, it's editable so you can raise, lower in 500rpm increments or leave it as it is..I'd just go with Takegawa ficon as it's much more simpler to install than kitaco but you won't really need either if you just get the latest big injector. Even I don't need it as there is not much difference between running my injector alone at 13.5afr wot and using ficon to drop it to 12afr wot. I can't feel any diff in performance and 13.5 wit afr is not that bad at all. I just can't be bothered to pull it out so it's in there now..

Actually, I had a thought about this:
Could you intentionally limit your rpm to say, 8500 in order to keep it within the peak power range?

I honestly don't know if that's an actual benefit, as it may essentially mean that there's no difference between 70% throttle and WOT. But I assume anything above 8500 has diminishing returns and just burns gas unnecessarily.

I'm also wondering whether the performance difference of less than 13.5 afr is something you won't necessarily notice without longer gearing or going uphill, as I would think a 10% bump in acceleration isn't something I can tell without doing timed runs.

[you you]

So, any engine mods worked out then?

[Valiant]

So, any engine mods worked out then?

For me? I haven't tried any yet.

For others, it seems like many worked, though the Takegawa kit didn't work too well for pcxdemon.

As for any other failures, I suppose anyone who had an engine blow up in the middle of the freeway wouldn't be alive to tell about it .

[Pcxdemon]

So, any engine mods worked out then?

For me? I haven't tried any yet.

For others, it seems like many worked, though the Takegawa kit didn't work too well for pcxdemon.

As for any other failures, I suppose anyone who had an engine blow up in the middle of the freeway wouldn't be alive to tell about it .

Takegawa didn't work out well for me and I think I mentioned this to you before was because I took it beyond what it was supposed to be. It's not sold with much bigger throttle body, valve springs and a pod filter set up which what I done to it afterwards, pushing it beyond it's designed limit. I am sure if you install it and leave it, as it is designed by takegawa it should be more than fine. But if you're after more power than in that case yuminashi is the go!

[Valiant]

Takegawa didn't work out well for me and I think I mentioned this to you before was because I took it beyond what it was supposed to be. It's not sold with much bigger throttle body, valve springs and a pod filter set up which what I done to it afterwards, pushing it beyond it's designed limit. I am sure if you install it and leave it, as it is designed by takegawa it should be more than fine. But if you're after more power than in that case yuminashi is the go!

True, but I'd consider changing the head gaskets every 3000 miles to be an annoying issue.

As for Yuminashi, Reggy isn't responding to either e-mails or messaging on Facebook(quite likely because I haven't friended him). As I'm not sure if a different staff handles the direct sales orders, I don't feel inclined to roll the dice on whether or not the parts will ship out. So I'm checking to see what Roman has to offer with his 175cc kit.

[Pcxdemon]

Why do you think takegawa head gasket needs to be changed every 3000miles? I don't see why it would fail unless you fiddle with it afterwards like I have...leave the kit as it comes and and no further to increase more power and it should last fine and we'll past 3000miles. I would have no hesitation to use Takegawa again but as it's designed to as opposed to mod it further past their design.

[Valiant]

Why do you think takegawa head gasket needs to be changed every 3000miles? I don't see why it would fail unless you fiddle with it afterwards like I have...leave the kit as it comes and and no further to increase more power and it should last fine and we'll past 3000miles. I would have no hesitation to use Takegawa again but as it's designed to as opposed to mod it further past their design.

Because you said so? Or rather, that was what you said Takegawa's reply was.

In any case, I'd like to wait for a reply from Roman at rzracing. Might do well to at least compare the cost of the two.

We're still not sure if the 31mm throttle body will fit my new 2015 PCX, as Yuminashi's site states that their's won't.

http://www.hondapcx.org/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=3414

I have to say this...yuminashi big bore is better. Why? Well it's slightly smaller than takegawa in cc's and that will give you a safety margin regarding head gasket space between water jacket and combustion chamber. It means there is less likely a chance of head gasket failure and a leak. Point 2, it uses a single layer gasket like a Honda stock gasket which also means of less failure than a triple layer takegawa gasket. Point 3, because it's a single layer gasket, compression is higher which means it will be more powerful than takegawa kit.
However takegawa is good kit as well, but, when my head gasket failed after 5000km,their reply was 'head gasket is a consumable part and it's advised to replace gasket after 5000km...also,it's made for racing application so no warranty afterwards is given unless you have received defective product and they would replace it immediately..