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It's extremely complicated.

Unfortunately the right to own and carry firearms was written into the Constitution. It had a good reason when it was added. That reason may or may not be valid any more, but now it would take a supreme effort to repeal it. So we have to move forward and try to restrict sales of firearms without stepping on other Constitutional Rights.

When you have as many paid lobbyists as Washington has, most of the people who represent us are more influenced by the almighty dollar than by a need to represent us. The amount of extra "salary" our Representatives get from lobbyists doubles their government paycheck. Why do you think they want to stay in office for 30 years? They don't represent us. They represent themselves.

That is also why most of our Representatives are exempted from the very laws they pass. They wrote that into the laws.
They have their own bank, their own medical insurance, their own 401k, their own free transportation. Then add what the lobbyists give them. Why represent the peasant when you can get a bigger paycheck to represent the rich?

Statistics show that where guns are banned crime is rampant,where guns are allowed crime is reduced dramatically.
https://www.factcheck.org/2012/12/gun-r ... gun-facts/

easyrider wrote:Statistics show that where guns are banned crime is rampant,where guns are allowed crime is reduced dramatically.

In Scotland in year 2015-16 there was one homicide in which a firearm was used.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-38143327
Scotland has very restrictive firearm legislation and a population of around 5.3 million.
We have been making firearm ownership more difficult in Scotland, taking guns out of circulation and crime figures are decreasing.

The USA has a population of around 320 million and guns are widespread.
For your assertion to be correct, the number of firearm homicides in the USA would have to have been significantly less than 60.
But it wasn't.
http://time.com/5011599/gun-deaths-rate ... -cdc-data/

I strongly believe that violence leads to violence.

Just to further support GN2's case.
Hungarian population is 9.8 million, also with a very restrictive firearm legislation.
Last four years number of homicides and suicides where firearms were used was 4, 7, 6 and 4 in order and they're steady.
Total number of firearm related crime (including robbery, threathening, attempted murder etc) was sub 50 for the entire population YoY.
Apart from the suicides, almost only home made or otherwise tampered (e.g. de-neutralised) firearms were used.

I really don't see the effect of higher crime rate due to less firearms.

But I think this topic was about something else originally. Sociologists have concluded long time ago, that the fact if the punishment is unavoidable is a lot more effective than the severity of the retaliation. So unfortunately as long the police is not going after them it would be difficult to stop this epidemic. I dunno what have to happen to get the critical mass of angriness to get something changed.

Probably in case word would get out in their circles that sooner or later all of the thieves were visited by a few angry bikers and somehow the've fallen the stairs during a spirited discussion I'm sure it would help a bit.

Probably correct..however those numbers are largely predicated where guns are banned or prohibited. Statistics in America shows that where gun ownership is encouraged or allowed deaths from gunfire is negligible. Our main gun homicides are in Chicago and big cities like New York where guns are extremely hard to get and not legal to carry. The problem is the bad guys will always have guns no matter what laws you pass. That is like music to their ears. Where good folks are stymied and indefensible the criminal gets full reign.I know if I'm in a crowded movie theater and some loonie stands up and starts shooting away I am praying to God someone is carrying an equalizer and will stop the mayhem
Re : Scotland.. Does not seem logical for criminals to stop using guns because the law says no more guns.Perhaps you have nicer criminals.(see link below) The black mkt will always provide guns and if there is a will there is a way. Most people are myopic in their thinking. Seems simple.... take away guns and shooting will also go away.Just doesn't work that way unfortunately

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/katiepavl ... d-n1464528

Meanwhile. . .back at the ranch. . .

gn2 wrote:

easyrider wrote:Statistics show that where guns are banned crime is rampant,where guns are allowed crime is reduced dramatically.

In Scotland in year 2015-16 there was one homicide in which a firearm was used.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-38143327
Scotland has very restrictive firearm legislation and a population of around 5.3 million.
We have been making firearm ownership more difficult in Scotland, taking guns out of circulation and crime figures are decreasing.

The USA has a population of around 320 million and guns are widespread.
For your assertion to be correct, the number of firearm homicides in the USA would have to have been significantly less than 60.
But it wasn't.
http://time.com/5011599/gun-deaths-rate ... -cdc-data/

+1
The proliferation of guns in the U.S. is indefensible, sad, and embarrassing.

signed - an American conscientious objector who served as an unarmed combat medic in the Vietnam war

The proliferation of guns in the U.S. is indefensible, sad, and embarrassing.

signed - an American conscientious objector who served as an unarmed combat medic in the Vietnam war

If you haven't already. . .check out a movie called "Hacksaw Ridge". True story about Pfc. Desmond Doss. WWII Pacific.

Thank you for your Service!

And.....I'm Not Going To Take it Anymore!
This topic is a Done Deal.

Apologies go out to member Hax. Sorry this thread went awry.

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