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Can a PCX150 stop faster than a FZ-07?

Posted: Sat Sep 30, 2017 8:08 pm
by Ringding
Hello from Canada! I am new here.
I bought this PCX150 for my dad but I ride it whenever I get a chance because it is so much fun!
Made this video because I noticed how nice the brakes work on the PCX compared to the FZ-07.
Something you don't see in the video is the fact that it takes a lot less effort to stop the PCX150 than the FZ-07.


Re: Can a PCX150 stop faster than a FZ-07?

Posted: Sat Sep 30, 2017 8:38 pm
by homie
YAY! Irish... nice stoppie :lol:
I think the only people who complain about the PCX brakes don't ride bigger bikes.

Re: Can a PCX150 stop faster than a FZ-07?

Posted: Sat Sep 30, 2017 10:55 pm
by TheMaverick
Very interesting - thanks for posting!

(would have preferred it without the music though to be honest) (sorry!).

I've always felt that the PCX brakes were pretty good. So long as they're not snatched (inducing a front wheel skid) then they're pretty much only limited by the amount of force that keeps the back wheel near the ground.

I was watching a slow-mo of MotoGP champ Marc Marques under braking a few months ago - starting from some ungodly speed - back wheel about an inch off the ground - bike snaking around a bit. Unbelieveable what they can do on those bikes.


Re: Can a PCX150 stop faster than a FZ-07?

Posted: Sat Sep 30, 2017 11:16 pm
by dgnyberg
Braking is how I jacked up my knee.
My left hand is constantly numb, and I had to brake quickly.
Apparently, my right hand grabbed tighter than my left hand.
I ended up doing an uncontrolled stoppie.
The rear of the bike came up and swung to the left, my left leg went down to keep me from losing control.
I jammed my leg quite extensively. And that was after I shattered the femur in that leg a year earlier.
Oh, well, at least the scoot came out of it uninjured. I'll heal.
And while I heal, I get to work on the scoot!!

Dave

Re: Can a PCX150 stop faster than a FZ-07?

Posted: Sat Sep 30, 2017 11:45 pm
by TheMaverick
dgnyberg wrote:Braking is how I jacked up my knee.
My left hand is constantly numb, and I had to brake quickly.
Apparently, my right hand grabbed tighter than my left hand.
I ended up doing an uncontrolled stoppie.
The rear of the bike came up and swung to the left, my left leg went down to keep me from losing control.
I jammed my leg quite extensively. And that was after I shattered the femur in that leg a year earlier.
Oh, well, at least the scoot came out of it uninjured. I'll heal.
And while I heal, I get to work on the scoot!!

Dave
Thank goodness the scooter was OK!

J/k

Sorry to hear - yeah - panic stops can be nasty business. I practice mine from time to time, but probably not often enough. I'm told that the "trick" is not to snatch it so it gives a moment for the forces on the front wheel to load up (thus preventing a lockup) before the heavy braking starts, but it's all split-second timing (literally).

Re: Can a PCX150 stop faster than a FZ-07?

Posted: Sun Oct 01, 2017 5:16 am
by gn2
If the Yamaha had ABS it would stop better than a PCX.

Re: Can a PCX150 stop faster than a FZ-07?

Posted: Sun Oct 01, 2017 9:21 am
by Mel46
I have said it before and I will say it again. The PCX needs disc brakes in the back to make it more effective, and more up to date.

Re: Can a PCX150 stop faster than a FZ-07?

Posted: Sun Oct 01, 2017 4:08 pm
by TheMaverick
Mel46 wrote:I have said it before and I will say it again. The PCX needs disc brakes in the back to make it more effective, and more up to date.
I don't understand why, considering that on the PCX both brakes are linked, and the front one is the only one capable of any serious stopping power once the weight transfers.

Re: Can a PCX150 stop faster than a FZ-07?

Posted: Sun Oct 01, 2017 4:49 pm
by Mel46
In that case, why update the braking systems on car? They had drum brakes for the longest time. Disc brakes are more effective at what they do than drum brakes are. If cars warrant 4 wheel disc brake systems, why don't bikes warrant 2 wheel disc brake systems?

Re: Can a PCX150 stop faster than a FZ-07?

Posted: Sun Oct 01, 2017 6:22 pm
by springer1
I dunno, the Double Leading Shoe front brake on my 1970 650 Triumph is just plain fantastic, was used from '68-'70.

A DLS setup is more expensive than a typical Single Leading Shoe because it has a cam on both ends of the shoes and spreads both ends of the shoes simultaneously and equally. I know the "improved" version used from 71-72 has linkage issues.

Anyway - a quality drum brake setup correctly can be seriously effective .... but I guess a typical disk is better than a typical drum. I have no issues with the PCX brakes.

Re: Can a PCX150 stop faster than a FZ-07?

Posted: Sun Oct 01, 2017 8:35 pm
by TheMaverick
Mel46 wrote:In that case, why update the braking systems on car? They had drum brakes for the longest time. Disc brakes are more effective at what they do than drum brakes are. If cars warrant 4 wheel disc brake systems, why don't bikes warrant 2 wheel disc brake systems?
Many do, but at the end of the day, the PCX isn't a high-performance sport bike that needs something like that. My question would be "what performance advantage would a rear disk brake give us?" I can't think of a single one.

On a car they make it easier to inspect - and the hydraulic action gives more leverage - but neither of those things are needed on a PCX.

Re: Can a PCX150 stop faster than a FZ-07?

Posted: Sun Oct 01, 2017 9:42 pm
by alx123
The Nmax brakes are both disc front and rear and its4 awesome. High performance or not, the more braking power at your disposal the better. Imo

Forget it without abs though, as in my experience it is easier to lock the disc than the drum.

Is it possible to put abs on drums? Im not sure

Re: Can a PCX150 stop faster than a FZ-07?

Posted: Sun Oct 01, 2017 10:02 pm
by TheMaverick
alx123 wrote:The Nmax brakes are both disc front and rear and its4 awesome. High performance or not, the more braking power at your disposal the better. Imo

Forget it without abs though, as in my experience it is easier to lock the disc than the drum.

Is it possible to put abs on drums? Im not sure
That's kinda my point - if either technology has enough stopping power to lock the wheel (which isn't hard to do in an emergency stop situation because all the weight moves onto the front wheel) - then it becomes pretty much moot at that point. Might be a different story on a superbike where the back brake is being used to stop the bike doing a wheelie - or in a car where the weight distribution is different (you won't see a car doing a "stoppie"). Just can't see any advantage (nor disadvantage either) on a PCX though.

Re: Can a PCX150 stop faster than a FZ-07?

Posted: Sun Oct 01, 2017 10:14 pm
by alx123
I swear you can lock the disc faster than the drum. The pcx might not actually need the extra braking power (arguable), but anything better is always a welcome improvement. Imo

Besides, with a pillion, you might need a better stronger rear braking power.

And I also heard the disc cools faster than the drum, this might be very helpful in long distance travels esp if decelerating and applying brakes more often.

Is it needed on the pcx? Maybe not. Is it better? Yes.

Re: Can a PCX150 stop faster than a FZ-07?

Posted: Sun Oct 01, 2017 10:41 pm
by TheMaverick
alx123 wrote:I swear you can lock the disc faster than the drum.
So that makes the disc a disadvantage.
The pcx might not actually need the extra braking power (arguable), but anything better is always a welcome improvement. Imo
Try as I might, I just can't see the logic in that in the case of the PCX. In any emergency braking scenario the minimal contribution from the rear brake is easily met by either brake technology. Different story for the front brake, but that's moot because it's disk anyway. What limits PCX braking is the max amount of force you can apply to the front brake before it cartwheels. The CBS further makes any rear brake technology moot because it'll apply front brake long before the back brake locks on normal surfaces.
Besides, with a pillion, you might need a better stronger rear braking power.
I do a lot of my riding with a pillion (at or above max all up weight) and it's still the front brake doing most of the work. Stopping distances are increased by about 50% (that's what it feels like anyway), but none of that is due to the rear brake being in any way deficient.
And I also heard the disc cools faster than the drum, this might be very helpful in long distance travels esp if decelerating and applying brakes more often.
Again, just can't see it being an advantage on a PCX. I've taken the PCX on up to 500km trips in a day - including several hills where there's 8 to 12km of mountainous down-hill with frequent corners - it's just not an issue with the brakes.
Is it needed on the pcx? Maybe not. Is it better? Yes.
But is it better on a PCX? I'd bet that in a blind test (including emergency braking) that approx 100% of PCX riders wouldn't be able to tell the difference nor would there be any difference in stopping distances.

Re: Can a PCX150 stop faster than a FZ-07?

Posted: Mon Oct 02, 2017 1:46 am
by you you
Your opinion is pretty clear now. :D :D :roll:

Re: Can a PCX150 stop faster than a FZ-07?

Posted: Mon Oct 02, 2017 1:49 am
by TheMaverick
you you wrote:Your opinion is pretty clear now. :D :D :roll:
#StalkerBeGone!

Re: Can a PCX150 stop faster than a FZ-07?

Posted: Mon Oct 02, 2017 2:03 am
by alx123
what I can't figure out is why the lack of ABS on a 2015 FZ-07 model? I would've thought that ABS is the new standard for bigger engine bikes years ago.

Or it might be just a recent trend since the new MT-03 is already equipped with ABS.

Re: Can a PCX150 stop faster than a FZ-07?

Posted: Mon Oct 02, 2017 3:25 am
by TheMaverick
alx123 wrote:what I can't figure out is why the lack of ABS on a 2015 FZ-07 model? I would've thought that ABS is the new standard for bigger engine bikes years ago.

Or it might be just a recent trend since the new MT-03 is already equipped with ABS.
Still only optional on many bikes. Would have thought it’s a no-brainer myself, but apparently some don’t like the extra weight and cost.

Re: Can a PCX150 stop faster than a FZ-07?

Posted: Mon Oct 02, 2017 4:33 am
by gn2
ABS isn't mandatory in the USA so until it is bikes will continue to have sub standard brakes.