2015 PCX 150 sounds like a Rod Knock

[you you]

I’ve got two and neither click

[MichaelGee]

It’s clicking in the front by the ECM
when it clicks, it accelerates..

Will be testing ECM powerline to sensors today
verify powerline comms and for shorts..

what is leading me to ECM faults, cleared DTC’s and set Zero calibration of sensors.. Plus i eliminated air leaks, all fuel issues, any oil bearing issues, and drive issues.. Nothing Left but wires and ECM

Retested for DTC’s and ECM is solid MIL light, according to service manual that’s an ECM fault.. Have to jump back n forth in manual from ignition and codes..

No Codes = MIL on then Off and stays off
This thing stays on..

It’s like i am so far Advanced in spark timing, that’s why I verified TDC to cam Mark on valve train, just didn’t go far enough i guess

But..
what are the ODDS, that this goes out within 24hrs of changing oil and air filter “?”

Quite sure anyone could be traveling the path i took..

Everything will be New on this bike, other than general wear

[MichaelGee]

Traced all wires..
Verified all voltages.. ECM is okay thank goodness..

1st code i pulled out of this thing was 1-2
MAP sensor fault

I read this as 12

Watch this-
have to jump back n forth from Pre-2013 and After
21 or 2-1 o2 sensor
12 or 12-1 or -2 fuel injector

it’s the ONLY Damn sensor Left to replace relating to air/fuel
Tested IAC for proper operation, Good.. (thought it might be stuck open, Leaning A/F)

Lapeer Honda mis-ordered and sent the TPS sensor to Begin with..
I did not know it is a 3-way combination sensor
MAP-TPS-IAT

So it looks like ECM is locked at pre-program values of air temp, vacuum, and throttle position, even though i am riding through engine range..

Yea That’ll cause an A/F issue..
Maybe the clicking noise in the dash is related

Hope Lapeer Honda still has it, didn’t send it back to warehouse

[MichaelGee]

I don’t know who would go as detailed in depth on a bike
Without just selling it off and cutting losses..

Perseverance… With a little OCD kind of helps

[Limey]

I don’t know who would go as detailed in depth on a bike
Without just selling it off and cutting losses..

Me neither!!!

[MichaelGee]

So let me explain what happened
Just by Coincidence.. ironical..

i No Longer do multiple things at once, with This PCX
it gets expensive..

Remember only 75% throttle? Since purchased..
Remember air filter plugged up? Badly plugged up..

Opening up air intake finally gave MAP and IAT something to think about

with MAP and IAT throwing numbers now, it finally took out TPS sensor
DTC 1-2 MAP fault

Notice DTC picture.. 0° degrees Default mapping
That’s Not air temp, that’s spark timing..

Supposed to be 12°
BAM spark knocking

Waiting on call from Lapeer Honda as i type this..

[MichaelGee]

okay i am done playing around here..
Somebody Help

I’ve replaced / tested / verified all sensors except CKP
CKP will store a code on any faults, freeze frame data Clean
ECM is code free.. ECM is Zerod to TPS..
I’ve verified all sensor connectors at 5v clean
The new 5p sensor Fixed the 75% throttle issue

Complete New Fuel system - so that’s not it
No air Leaks anywhere - so that’s not it

What is Left to Lean out the bike at even keel cruising “?”

I STILL hear the Click in the dash, “click” and it wants to take off
it’s like when it Clicks, timing is advanced

i am upto $2200 in Costs for this thing
All new everything..

It was Not doing it Before spark plug, fuel cleaner and oil change

Wait... wonder if my plug wire took a shit??
Going to ohms test my plug wire

Boy That would piss me off
New Fuel pump etc.. o2 and Everything else..
It’s all Friggn New..

Pissed offfffff PCX owner

[you you]

Have you checked the valve timing and clearance?

[MichaelGee]

Yes
Verified TDC to Cam position (page 3)
Valves were a bit too tight
All in Spec

[MichaelGee]

Need to test this ECM again
Continuity on wires, and then to frame point
-voltage feeds
-signal feeds
Think it’s the ECM that “clicks” when throttle goes a bit past off-idle
could be the emissions purge solenoid, it’s right underneath ECM
But it seems way higher in the dash for some reason

Found an ECM for $100 2018 PCX
part numbers are different for 2018
same for 2015-17, wonder if it’d work or not “?”
i know in 2018 they added ABS and 2019 digital cluster

Probably give me constant MIL light..

[Old Grinner]

The 2019 engine is different . . ..

[MichaelGee]

okay that ECM is out..
Problem i am having trying to detect this fault

i have to Re-Assemble bike to test ride after Each thing I do..
Have to have a slight drag on engine for any of this to occur..

the throttle “click”
the “spark knock”

ALL Require a slight strain on engine for it to happen..

i do not own a Dyno platform to control rolling resistance

[MichaelGee]

Took my son David for a ride
1st time, a little nervous.. Didn’t know how to hang on, had to stop n sign to him to grab my shoulders and he was no longer pivoting back n forth when the CLICK happens in the dash..

Threw the cpr8ea-9 plug in there for a run, Minimal gap, perfect opportunity to take David for a ride

Spark knock is a bit Less with one heatrange cooler plug
So i ordered a cpr9ea-9 plug

[MichaelGee]

Finished a day with my grandson
Line test and trace for any and all Opens and Shorts
ECM 33p harness to sensors..

All have proper voltages
All have clean connections

No shorts or grounding of any signal or voltage lines
Continuity is clean all the way to ECM
-tested a line, Then touched a ground point to make sure it’s clean

ECM still clicks when slowly taking off (it is the ECM that clicks)
Hard to keep 10-15mph, a touch more throttle and “Click”
off she wants to go

When the next heatrange colder spark plug comes in, I’ll ohm my plug wire

[MichaelGee]

Hunt n Peck
seems all I am doing is replacing Everything

Trying to avoid the $350 ECM purchase
Add the ECM and i will be close to a white PCX i found for $2800 with 100miles on it

All that is Left to replace:
-ECM
-CKP sensor

New level 9 spark plug came in, Coldest NGK heatrange we can get for this engine.. Now the Spark Knocking doesn’t start until 25mph, then There it is..

Another thing- ran a mile run to store, 50mph road, much more power than ever before, All the way through throttle range additional power.. Zipped right upto 65mph before backing off the throttle looking for cops “?”

Damn thing flies down the road, Effortlessly..

[MichaelGee]

Thinking about cutting open my ECM
get to whatever relay is in their Clicking..
Then jam some electrical tape in there to keep it open..
Maybe it’s supposed to click—on full throttle “?”
ya know advancing at hard acceleration

What difference does it make, all possible problems here all lead back to the Same thing in the Tech Manual, replace ECM with a known good one and retest.. Don’t have $379 bucks

Just going to sit here till Spring tax return anyway, buy one with taxes..

Don’t give a crap anymore, absolutely No Idea why this thing has advanced it’s spark to spark knocking, I’ve replaced the 5p multi-sensor that triggers 0° timing, so That’s not it..

IF it was a defective CKP sensor, system would detect and not allow bike to start..

Definitely Losing hair on this one

[maddiedog]

"it’s been Stolen, running around from the cops in fields Without a Gas cap and ignition lock switch" oh boy, I would have ran. This was a fun saga to read though. Sounds like you're having fun fixing it, even if it is frustrating.

-Tensioner - have you actually checked the timing chain? If it clicks at full send or when you pull the throttle hard then cut it, that is 10/10 a symptom of timing chain slap from a bad tensioner. Downing to a colder plug means less boom boom means less chain slap - if that's the issue.

- Air filter - case vent plugged with grass - oh boy, did you trace this past into the actual intake valve to make sure there's not crap stuck behind a valve? If the valve's sticking from there being crap there, it can cause weirdness and clicking. Pulling more throttle getting the clicking to go away indicates you're changing intake parameters, so perhaps whatever it is is blocking less with more throttle?

- Lean vs not - the ECU and FI is really good on these bikes, I would stick with a stock plug and not futz with that. I really doubt it's the FI unless it had like diesel or something. You mentioned it was without a gas cap, bad / wrong gas can cause pinging and bad detonation. Have you completely and totally absolutely drained the fuel system and refilled it with fresh gas? I saw you did the pump and filter, did you check the tank for crap while you were at it? If the tank's rusted out and nasty, it's just going to plug the next filter and starve it.

- Oil - Non-motorcycle grade oil is fine. This wasn't caused by you running generic 10w30 synthetic through it.

If this were mine, I'd pull the head next to just look inside and see wtf the valves looked like after the above.

[MichaelGee]

"it’s been Stolen, running around from the cops in fields Without a Gas cap and ignition lock switch" oh boy, I would have ran. This was a fun saga to read though. Sounds like you're having fun fixing it, even if it is frustrating.

-Tensioner - have you actually checked the timing chain? If it clicks at full send or when you pull the throttle hard then cut it, that is 10/10 a symptom of timing chain slap from a bad tensioner. Downing to a colder plug means less boom boom means less chain slap - if that's the issue. Only rattles at Even speed, No rattle accelerating or decelerating

- Air filter - case vent plugged with grass - oh boy, did you trace this past into the actual intake valve to make sure there's not crap stuck behind a valve? If the valve's sticking from there being crap there, it can cause weirdness and clicking. Pulling more throttle getting the clicking to go away indicates you're changing intake parameters, so perhaps whatever it is is blocking less with more throttle? Intake Vents, where the air enters of airbox and cvt cover, nothing passed air cleaner

- Lean vs not - the ECU and FI is really good on these bikes, I would stick with a stock plug and not futz with that. I really doubt it's the FI unless it had like diesel or something. You mentioned it was without a gas cap, bad / wrong gas can cause pinging and bad detonation. Have you completely and totally absolutely drained the fuel system and refilled it with fresh gas? I saw you did the pump and filter, did you check the tank for crap while you were at it? If the tank's rusted out and nasty, it's just going to plug the next filter and starve it. Tank clean, new pump filter, line blown out, new injector, fresh fuel, new gas cap but it didn’t have one when I got it, and spark knocking started Before i put gas cap on “?” So no fuel restrictions

- Oil - Non-motorcycle grade oil is fine. This wasn't caused by you running generic 10w30 synthetic through it.

If this were mine, I'd pull the head next to just look inside and see wtf the valves looked like after the above.

Additional- iac valve is properly functioning, but rpm does not high-idle when cold start, wondering to replace ECT now

Bluetooth obd and 4pin to obd2 and still no communication link, using a laptop with vci cable to adapter cable and running K-Line still no connection..

I am doing Everything i can..

Here is a video of someone else having the Same problem as i am, significantly louder with slight engine strain at road speed.. in video- when guy gets to right side of bike

https://youtu.be/5mpvf9xkx7Q

[MichaelGee]

There is nothing until over 15-20mph
Then the rattling starts at EVEN speeds and is Loud
Much quieter with a 9 heatrange plug

There is No Rattle accelerating
There is No Rattle decelerating
There is No Rattle at idle
There is No Rattle putzn at 10mph
There is No Rattle putzn at 15mph

Unplugged coolant sensor, hard starting so That’s not it..

EVERY Sensor Checked Replaced except CKP and ECM
-new fuel pump and filter (6hr job here)
-new injector
-new TPS MAP AirTemp
-new o2 sensor
-multiple spark plug heat ranges
-verified IAC
-verified ECM to sensor connections (ALL of them)
-verified ECT
-disconnected EVAP and plugged intake line (Lean test)
-bought multiple OBD2 crap to see K-line info, Bluetooth and laptop, even Honda software, Nothing worked no connection.. used VCI link to laptop..

All Attempts above were a Waste of Time
Still doing it.. although Less spark knock Loudness with cp9 heatrange plug

I changed the oil 900ml then spark plug and air filter, within 24hrs it began spark knocking

it is Exactly as the above video, he has to give it a little gas for the spark knock to quickly occur because it needs a slight engine drag for it to happen.. and it is Constant at any Even speed above 20mph, very Loud

[MichaelGee]

New and including
-new Dr Pulley weights and slides
-new belt
-new clutch
-fresh hub oil
-new ignition lock switch
-new panels

This would be thee ultimate PARTS bike
Everything’s new..

What a waste..