How to reduce your coronavirus infection risk

[Mel46]

Unfortunately there is a part of me that cares about others who are worse off than me, and in the case that I described above there was a 75 year old widow in an area that got the bad end of the recent hurricane. Her house was OK, but she had no power, cable or phone. We found out from some friends in the neighborhood who had cellphones. Several called us. They were dealing with their own hurricane problems, but they knew that we would help, so they called us.

We stopped for the coffee because we figured that she would love to have something warm to drink. I know that whenever I was in hurricane-torn regions while I was in the Coast Guard, coffee was always welcome.

Yes, we could have waited for our home coffee machine to kick out some coffee, but the trip to the old neighborhood is a little ove an hour's drive one way. That means 2 hours of the day is lost just in travel time...and for older people trapped in their homes without power, that is a long time.

If we don't help each other, who will?

[gn2]

Masks may stop droplets but they do ZERO to stop the virus spreading as an aerosol.

This is based on a false premise.
Virus alone can pass through masks, but when exhaled by a human it is always contained within the water in the breath.
If two people are wearing masks and standing six feet apart they cannot infect each other.
All the countries which have had success at blocking transmission of the virus have used masks as a key part of their strategy.

[you you]

Masks may stop droplets but they do ZERO to stop the virus spreading as an aerosol.

This is based on a false premise.
Virus alone can pass through masks, but when exhaled by a human it is always contained within the water in the breath.
If two people are wearing masks and standing six feet apart they cannot infect each other.
All the countries which have had success at blocking transmission of the virus have used masks as a key part of their strategy.

This is true, breath or spit.

There is much more misinformation than information going around. And more opinions than fact. Let's keep it somewhere else?

[Coasting]

If two people are wearing masks and standing six feet apart they cannot infect each other.

Unfortunately that's just not the case. If the breath makes if out of the mask then the virus makes it out with it; one doesn't breath humid air into one side of a mask and have it come out the other side with 0% humidity. If you stuck a cigarette at the end of a long tube - cigarette outside - smoker inside - smoker exhales into a mask - I guarantee someone walking into a typically ventilated room will still easily be able to smell the smoke. Now consider that the virus is one hell of a lot smaller than smoke particles.

Two people wearing masks won't be able to infect each other via droplets, but that's about it -- it has minimal effect on aerosolised material. The masks we're seeing used have their origins on operating theatres; they're worn to prevent surgeon droplets getting into the incision - not to protect the surgeon. Outside two people 6 feet apart both wearing masks would have a negligible chance of passing the infection -- but completely different ballgame inside - and I suspect that that's what's catching people out. Will be more of a problem as winter hits too.

Just to really lay this one to rest I'll copy/paste from a transcript of Dr Michael Osterholm's interview on the Joe Rogan podcast.

https://www.rev.com/blog/transcripts/jo ... oronavirus

"Joe Rogan: (07:51)
Now, what can be done? What can the average person do? I see people walking around with masks on, wearing gloves. Is that nonsense?

Michael Osterholm: (07:59)
Largely, yes. First of all, let’s step back, the primary mechanism for transmission is just the respiratory route, it’s just breathing. In studies in Germany, which just have been published literally in the last 24 hours, they actually followed a group of people who had been exposed to somebody in an automobile manufacturing plant and then they had nine people that, with this exposure, he said, “if you have any symptoms at all, contact us we want to follow up with you.” And they all agreed.

Michael Osterholm: (08:25)
Well, they got infected. And so in the very first hours just feeling bad, sore throat, they went in and sampled the throats, their saliva, their nose for virus, they did blood, they did stool, they did urine. And they found that at that very moment when they first got sick, they had incredibly high levels of virus, sometimes 10000 times that we saw with SARS, in their throats. Meaning they were infectious at that point already and they hadn’t even had symptoms yet of really any nature, they weren’t coughing yet. And that’s where we’re concerned because that’s the kind of transmission… I always have said, “Trying to stop influenza virus transmission is like try to stop the wind.” We’ve never had anything successfully do that other than vaccine and we don’t have a vaccine here."

And

"Michael Osterholm: (44:20)
One of the things, people want to do something. They want to feel like they’re doing something, and so we tell them, “Wash your hands often to prevent this disease.” I feel like we’re not being really honest with the people. That the data, and we’ve looked at this very carefully, really is about just breathing air, and that’s a hard thing to stop. Keep doing the hand washing, but don’t think that that’s going to stop the disease. You asked about the masks-

Joe Rogan: (44:44)
It’s going to stop other stuff. Yes, the masks.

Michael Osterholm: (44:46)
Well, there’s two kinds. Basically, the surgical mask, which just fits over. The reason it’s called a surgical mask is because it’s loose fitting, just fits, kind of ties behind you. It was worn by surgeons so that they don’t cough or drip into your wound. It was never made to protect you from bugs coming in, so those little spaces on the sides, that’s not a problem if I’m breathing into the cloth right in front of my nose, but in terms of the air coming in on the side, they’re not effective at all. People wear them, they look like they’re doing something, they’re not."

All the countries which have had success at blocking transmission of the virus have used masks as a key part of their strategy.

Again, not so. Some have, some haven't. We haven't.

The bottom line is that if a contagious person spends any non-trivial length of time in a confined space then others inhaling their exhaled breath are going to get infected - masks or no masks. They don't do any harm - but they don't do a lot of good either. Figures I've seen suggest less than 15% effectiveness.

[Coasting]

I don't want this to turn into a pissing contest, so I'll just leave it by saying that you might like to revisit the excellent site that you linked to in your first post (thanks for that by the way) - it pretty much hits all the points I made;

- Lack of indoor ventilation is the big one

- In a poorly ventilated space infections are largely proportional to length of exposure.

- The importance of distance becomes less and less over time as infected air will eventually circulate

- The referenced site and other research I've read have come to slightly different conclusions about the effectiveness of masks, but they're both in agreement that they're not going to have anywhere near the impact on infection rates that proper ventilation & minimal time exposure time; one is far more likely to avoid infection by avoiding crowded indoor spaces that have no ventilation (or limiting their time there if the former isn't possible) than they are if they hang around those places wearing masks & staying 6 feet apart.

Live long and prosper folks; we're probably going to hit 600,000+ infections per day sometime this week - and I'm not seeing any data to suggest that it won't be 1 million per day closer to Christmas. And the impact of the economic fallout long-term will be far far worse (expect rising suicide rates from those who have lost jobs, businesses, life savings, and homes) - poorer health outcomes due to delayed diagnosis and treatment, and poorer health (and it's associated impact on lifespan) due to far more people living in poverty; unable to afford quality food and warm/dry housing. The full economic recovery is likely to be measured in a period of time between "decades" and "generations" (if the debt and it's associated interest can be repaid at all; most of the projections don't account for the burden of an additional fiscal insults to the global economy ... and I suspect that there are going to be many more over the coming decades); we're not even at the end of the beginning yet. It's almost a blessing that I probably woun't be around to experience them. I pity those who do.

[Old Grinner]

Some "Survival of the Fittest" quotes . . .. Worth a read.

You can scroll down and read the short ones if you're in a hurry.

https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/tag/su ... he-fittest

[Mel46]

So what you are saying is that if you don't wear a mask you will be just as well off as a person who does wear a mask. I'm sorry but I disagree. Doing nothing is a guarantee that you will eventually get it.

As an example, we live right next door to some really nice guys who refuse to wear a mask. We often go out to eat with them, or shopping, or just talk over the fence with each other (4 foot fence). My wife and I wear masks. They don't. Both of them were tested two days ago and came back positive for Covid-19. We were tested because we are around them. We are negative.

I have to believe that the difference is the masks.

[Old Grinner]

On Fox News this morning it was reported that a lot of "counterfeit" 3M masks have flooded inventories, particularly in Washington State, and officials are trying to sort it out.

The quality of the "fakes" is not up to 3M specs and thus a risk to use . . ..

https://www.foxnews.com/health/washingt ... s-3m-sauer

It's just one of many stories of failures in the supply chain for PPE over the last year (including millions spent to "fake" vendors who never delivered).

So whatever you are using it's wise to take a second look to make sure it's genuine.

[gn2]

For general public use any face covering is better than no covering.

[springer1]

For general public use any face covering is better than no covering.

That's correct. That's why I applied Gorilla Glue to the edges of my mask ..... there's just no way I ever- ever- ever want to be without it and those flimsy straps can break at the most opportune time. Plus, it works great as a weight loss system. It's a true double-barrel simultaneous shot of healthy living.

[Gil]

I like all the comments in the thread. I'm glad to see that we are all taking this threat seriously and doing something about it. I agree with the sentiment the the N95 mask is the most effective. It's a disappointment that a year into this and there is still a shortage of N95 mask available. I think that the lack of proper masks is hindering our efforts to contain the virus. In my latino community here in Santa Cruz county, CA, many people just wear suboptimal one layer mask. Even though everyone wears a mask when in public. There is that but also many people in our latino community don't believe that the pandemic is real and that is costing us many lives.

Be safe everyone,
Gildardo O.

[Old Grinner]

A short but informative video on how to fix a broken mask string.

I found it seemed to happen to me more during the hot months of Summer. My theory is that perspiration softens up the attachment area. Just guessing.

[fish]

Signed up last week on-line - and received the first of the 2 Moderna vaccines today.
It has been a long year - but maybe....

"Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is, perhaps, the end of the beginning."

I think Bob Dylan said that

Fish

[springer1]

Signed up last week on-line - and received the first of the 2 Moderna vaccines today.
It has been a long year - but maybe....

"Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is, perhaps, the end of the beginning."

I think Bob Dylan said that

Fish

Winston Churchill. I think it was when the Germans were defeated in North Africa. Glad you got your 1st vaccination !

[easyrider]

Variants are doing their best to ignore vaccines.. Mother Earth is on the job..eliminating population ?.. only difference is we used to call them plagues.

[big bear]

i signed up for the shots was told that there is a 4 month wait even though im 66 and has a bus driver im a frontline worker pennsylvanias vaccination plan is terrible seems really haphazard. Only good thing i had the virus right after thanskgiving so i could have some immunity.Never had the breathing problems just stomach issues and couldent taste anything

[halluinoid]

well for about a year my wife and I have been having shopping DELIVERIES

I used to actually enjoy spending a couple of hours at the supermaket before COVID, but now that no longer happens, a van turns up outside our house instead yes it probably does reduce the risk but in the old days I would spend a couple of hours reading the newspapers in the supermarket canteen while my missus did 2 hours of shopping, whats not to like?