Shuddering and or Squealing Clutches...

[homie]

Taking the opportunity to address Shudder and Squeal as reported by too many in here. Watch the video as this is a possible source and solution in progress. I have recently experienced intermittent squeal and yesterday shuddering under a load as my wife took a rare ride with me to the fireworks show. Of course probably never going to ride again because something made noise and I attributed it to the LOAD what's wrong with me

Anyhow let's get this shudder thing nailed as a clutch shoe issue once and for all and then work out THE LOAD comment with the wife later. Going in to look for irregularities.

[you you]

Taking the opportunity to address Shudder and Squeal as reported by too many in here. Watch the video as this is a possible source and solution in progress. I have recently experienced intermittent squeal and yesterday shuddering under a load as my wife took a rare ride with me to the fireworks show. Of course probably never going to ride again because something made noise and I attributed it to the LOAD what's wrong with me

Anyhow let's get this shudder thing nailed as a clutch shoe issue once and for all and then work out THE LOAD comment with the wife later. Going in to look for irregularities.

In your face after that comment?

[homie]

Smooth as silk no shudder, no squeal or screech from the CVT on W.O.T. Pulls hard and steady like BABY BUELL
Going to make cleaning and sanding the clutch shoes a part of routine maintenance. Used Purple Power degreaser on the clutch outer race and 3M 600 grit wetdry sandpaper on the clutch shoes. A fine line between greasing your bearings and causing a problem for the clutch operation. Melted grease was gathering on the inner edge of the race and sneaking under the shoes intermittently, glazing the shoes, slipping and making weird noises.

Skill level for this job... Low

[alx123]

You this might work with the shuddering in cold starts instead of replacing it with the KVB clutch? Thanks for the vid

[easyrider]

I hope you don't have any future clutch issues,but typically once the material is contaminated it should be replaced.The fibers absorbed the oil grease and will come to the surface after heating up.I think metallic material is less affected and cleans better than Kevlar.However,what the hell may as well give it a good shot at sanding and cleaning and maybe all will be good.Not a big deal to replace the clutch pads and might be a good option as most shuddering issues are cured by using the 110 pads.They are significantly smoother . Installation video is available .

[homie]

I hope you don't have any future clutch issues,but typically once the material is contaminated it should be replaced.The fibers absorbed the oil grease and will come to the surface after heating up.I think metallic material is less affected and cleans better than Kevlar.However,what the hell may as well give it a good shot at sanding and cleaning and maybe all will be good.Not a big deal to replace the clutch pads and might be a good option as most shuddering issues are cured by using the 110 pads.They are significantly smoother . Installation video is available .

I'm anticipating the grease to keep coming But i'm in and out in just a few minutes so it's no big deal to keep this under surveillance. Does not explain shudder in members bikes that have never had the bearings greased. This is just one cause but certainly worth looking at with the next members bike who claims shudder issues. In other words I don't think the majority of people experiencing this abnormality have roller or belt failure, IMO I'm thinking its a contaminated clutch.

[fish]

Might consider practicing making a video, Or editing, before publishing?

Fish

[homie]

Might consider practicing making a video, Or editing, before publishing?
Fish

anytime you want to show us how Fish

[PCX150Rider]

Thanks Homie - The Driven Face thing still haunts eh? It's always something. Sounds like your fix will keep it going a while longer. It gives you plenty of time to get some replacement pads to put aside for later on.

[alx123]

the reason I asked is that my PCx don't have this shudder when new, so the clutch being contaminated or probably glazed is probably the reason, which can be solved hopefully by cleaning or sanding.

Now that's something I could do this weekend.

[homie]

It's not a new idea to sand the shoes, been presented in here since I membered. Not sure how long I will benefit from it since I obviously over greased the FACE DRIVEN bearing more than the 7 grams because I overdue everything (except my tech videos )

Now I'm curious about EZ's other clutch shoe materials comment. Like better brake pads you can buy better clutch shoes? Link me up!

[easyrider]

I was experiencing frequent shuddering upon take off. I would clean and sand the clutch pack but the shuddering would eventually come back. I have no idea what caused the glazing ; perhaps my 200 lb body weight contributed to the problem. At any rate another poster on here enlightened me to another pad with a different coefficient of friction material used on the 110. The part number he advised was 22535KVB900.I installed these pads and have not had any problems at all since the installation. I included a video I made on my first encounter doing a clutch pad replacement on a scooter. I fashioned a clutch spring compressor tool from some old angle supports I had on my boat trailer. I was not familiar as this was my first view of the inner workings. It shows the components and the procedure I used in real time so you will have some insight into whats involved in doing the swap. It really makes a difference in a smoother accel. and the job is really easy especially after doing it once.The set was 24.00 if I remember correctly ?? not sure ! I think the vid will help ..Sorry for the music . but my shop has speakers near the work table .You won't be disappointed in these pads .

https://1drv.ms/v/s!AvV-j2ZMUDvrnwMGeEtgRrHvACcz

[homie]

Thanks, that was an informative video. I have found your better clutch weights on ebay. Now that I see there are available there must be more that can be done to remove contaminants like oil and grease from existing clutch shoes. I wonder what temperature would burn off the petroleum from the saturated shoes? I'm of mind to discover a way to not replace shoes at the first sign of shudder. Lets cook my clutch weights and bake them dry for educational purposes. Suggest a temperature and I say we fire up the toaster oven. The average member isn't going to take on that job like you and I would... skill level is to high.

[PCX150Rider]

Lets cook my clutch weights and bake them dry for educational purposes. Suggest a temperature and I say we fire up the toaster oven. The average member isn't going to take on that job like you and I would... skill level is to high.

Smells like . . . Victory.

[you you]

Lets cook my clutch weights and bake them dry for educational purposes. Suggest a temperature and I say we fire up the toaster oven. The average member isn't going to take on that job like you and I would... skill level is to high.

Smells like . . . Victory.

Victory has gone it's now Indian.

[homie]

Been out trying to make it shudder by running it hard and anticipating more grease melt down getting on the clutch shoes and sure enough I was able to produce more muck on the shoes and race. So I removed all the grease from the bearing, heated it up with a hot air paint gun to melt it out and replaced with ever so little new marine quality grease on those two inner bearings. Then I mopped up again the clutch bell and shoes heating them to several hundred degrees until dry and re-sanded. All back together shiney and clean we RIDE SOME MORE! There simply must be a way to recover tainted clutch weight pads, I will find it!

[homie]

In conclusion from MY shudder experience...

Facts;
Shudder came from the clutch.
Weight shoes contact with the race in the outer bell were contaminated.
Too much grease from the Driven Face (2) bearings inside the clutch assembly leached into the bell.

Solution;
Remove all old grease from bearings and re-apply much less than 7 grams.
Degreased the clutch outer bell and race removing any and all petroleum.
Degreaser on the weight shoes and light sanding to rough the surface of each shoe.
Apply heat to each pad from a heat gun to a VERY hot temp burning off any petroleum saturation inside the pads.
Sand lightly again, reinstall and hope for the best.

Just put 30 miles on this process, no shudder, no squeal, pulling hard and feels right as rain.

[PCX150Rider]

Very fast turnaround on that project. Duly noted. Hope I can find this thread if it happens to me further down the line.

[PCX150Rider]

Victory has gone it's now Indian.

Yes. . .that's true. But I was referring to a quote from the movie "Apocalypse Now". . . https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k26hmRbDQFw

[alx123]

Tried opening the variator cover today to see how easy or hard its done and also to check the belt's condition after 1 year.

Done in 10 minutes, also belt still looking new.



Curently at 10500kms, At 12000 kms im planning to:

Change the engine oil
change the drive oil
install new air filter
check the variator and clutch (thanks for this thread)
check spark plug (i doubt i need to)

anything else i missed?

Oh btw, the shuddering at cold starts was gone a few days ago even though I didn't do anything..