2018 Honda PCX Performance

Drivetrain upgrades, engine upgrades, or any other mods to gain speed or acceleration.

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lolofigo
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Re: 2018 Honda PCX Performance

Post by lolofigo »

Heedehcheenuh wrote:
TheMaverick wrote:
Heedehcheenuh wrote:My 2015 Honda PCX 150 (K-18) ran 62-63mph on the rev limiter before the NCY variator change. I replaced it with the variator- face-13g rollers and saw the increase up to 70mph (speedometer) 73mph (GPS). I then installed the GIVI short windscreen and Leo Vince exhaust and she moved on up to 73mph (speedometer) but I have yet to check the GPS speed. I am pleased with the out come and may even do the gear change to help lower the rpm. I will so a bigger/taller rear tire also. Right now I am happy and she holds her own even on non busy interstate shots. I plan on keeping the PCX but also looking into another bigger bike/scoot as in the Kymco XTown 300i/Yamaha XMax/Suzuki Burgman 200/Sym CitiCom 300.
Any thoughts on doing a 175cc big bore kit while you're at it?

http://www.yuminashi.com/-pcx150-esp-17 ... ht-bore-k/
I was looking at the kits but not interested in then until this motor is ready to be overhauled. With just over 5k miles on the speddometer that will be some time lol. I may end up looking at the Kymco line first seeing as they are right across the state from me. Kymco USA being in Grenville S.C.

Heedehcheenuh
Chuck D
Ride on.....

p.s. I will plan on keeping the Honda but would like to have the bigger scooter/bike for long or touring rides.
I bought Kymco Downtown 300i and I'm very pleased with it. Everything looks one step better than pcx. Built quality isn't bad either. My pcx has yuminashi 164 kit installed and reaches 80 mph with 70 mph cruising speed but rest of the bike just can't cope with such speed.

Sent from my SM-N9005 using Tapatalk
Heedehcheenuh
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Re: 2018 Honda PCX Performance

Post by Heedehcheenuh »

lolofigo wrote: I bought Kymco Downtown 300i and I'm very pleased with it. Everything looks one step better than pcx. Built quality isn't bad either. My pcx has yuminashi 164 kit installed and reaches 80 mph with 70 mph cruising speed but rest of the bike just can't cope with such speed.

Sent from my SM-N9005 using Tapatalk
Yeah the X-Town 300i will be released this year in the US. it will replace the Downtown 300i. They also replaced the 500 with the 400 so I need to find one to try out. I have R.A. stage 3-4 and have mobility issues that prevent me from riding a bike. Scooters make it so much easier.

Heedehcheenuh
Chuck D
Ride on.....
2015 Honda PCX 150 (K-18)
Metallic Black
Leo Vince GP Corsa Exhaust
NCY Variator Kit and Drive Face with 18g rollers
Givi Windscreen D1136T
2 Wheels Down Head on a Swivel
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pendulum
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Re: 2018 Honda PCX Performance

Post by pendulum »

CaliCal wrote:Putting their elaborate sales pitch aside, if you send an offset temperature reading to the computer and that changes the air/fuel mixture to be richer, wont that help with performance?
It does but the minor performance gains are not worth the side effects if you plan on keeping your scoot for a long time. The resistor trick basically makes your scoot run more rich, which will leave more carbon deposits on the cylinder and you'll get worse fuel economy. Eventually the carbon deposits will build up so much you will lose power when you start having compression issues (like those old 80's american cars that don't go very fast when you step on the gas).

At the risk of sounding like your dad, there's a reason Honda didn't include the resistor trick on every scooter from the factory. ;) Companies like that one you found sell mods like this because the bad side effects aren't immediately apparent and by the time you notice it, that company will be long gone.

CaliCal wrote:Man, thats so disappointing but the notion that trying to make the PCX faster is a big headache and not worth makes me sad but it seems to make a lot of sense. At the end of the day I really enjoy riding my PCX but the power loss from the 2013 model is noticeable. Im going to order 13g rollers and put it in the stock vario. Might take a month or two but will report my findings back here. In the meantime, keep the comments rolling in on previous experiments.
Don't despair! I have the 13g's and a stock variator. Acceleration is very brisk, I can beat just about all traffic off the line and can keep pretty good pace with 250s. I don't think you need to change the variator on a PCX unless you intend to race it, IMO rollers alone can fix the acceleration issues.

Sounds like you were going to try the 13g, did they work out for you?
2015 PCX 150
Dr Pulley 13g
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GRONK
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Re: 2018 Honda PCX Performance

Post by GRONK »

I have also upgraded my PCX from 2016 model to a 2018 , i found it to also be slow in speed
My 2016 had exhaust and variator upgraded it was weppon
Yes strait to the shop for variator and exhaust if one is out there to suit a 2018 model
OldGuywhoTinkers
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Re: 2018 Honda PCX Performance

Post by OldGuywhoTinkers »

CaliCal wrote:Putting their elaborate sales pitch aside, if you send an offset temperature reading to the computer and that changes the air/fuel mixture to be richer, wont that help with performance?
April 6 2018

The whole point of modern computer engine management is to provide correct automatic fuel mixture ratio, and best drivability.

Why ? Answer: to have minimum emissions and maximize gas mileage. In the 1960's cars and motorcycles had to be tuned up
including spark plug and ignition point changes every 2,500 miles. If you are going to mess with any of this you had better
know what you are doing.

Think about this: When a piston aircraft takes off, the engine is loaded and stressed to maximum. Fuel mixture is adjusted (usually manually)
by the pilot to be a "rich" mixture. Let's say it is 5:1. It needs to be left that way for 3 - 5 minutes. Why ? So that the engine can deliver
maximum power for 2 - 5 minutes. AFTER the plane is in more normal horizontal flight and gaining altitude at a normal rate, the engine is exposed to
cooler temperatures at higher altitudes, and the pilot reduces throttle and to keep from both fouling plugs and wasting fuel the pilot leans it out to some value "less rich".
Let's say it is 14:1 instead of 5:1. (That maximizes his cruising range)

Now lets begin that take off all over again from zero with a richness setting of 14:1. We now physically stress that lycoming engine to maximum with the LEAN gas mixture ratio,
and about the time that we lift off the runway, we get something called DETONATION, which means that instead of gasoline burning on each cycle of power
producing thrust, five or six of the cylinders get EXPLOSIONS, not a quick, clean burning in hundreths of a second, but EXPLOSIONS. In less than 45 seconds we now
blow holes in at least 4 of the pistons either dime sized or quarter sized, and destroy the engine. (Pistons with holes don't produce power !) The engine is destroyed and the plane goes straight down !

A similar thing can happen in either cars or motorcycles or scooters. Be VERY careful about leaning out mixtures and thinking you are so much "wiser" than the factory. I can see an alterred "super lean" mixture causing problems with a wide open throttle at 60 mph.
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RichyP
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Re: 2018 Honda PCX Performance

Post by RichyP »

I didnt know that they changed the gearing on the 2015+ models!

I have a 2013 model, now with 21,000 miles on the clock and to be fair, I got bored of the slow speed on my model, so I bought a Kawasaki ER6N instead lol.

so if doing higher speed is your cuppa, just buy a bigger bike i would suggest. I know there are mod kids and performance upgrades and chips and bores and rollers etc etc etc, but for the cost and time it will take to install them for so little return in performance.. its hardly worth it..
WhiteJLY
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Re: 2018 Honda PCX Performance

Post by WhiteJLY »

CaliCal wrote:So I have an update on performance. I went in and got the first 600 mile tune up recommended by honda where they adjust the valves. After this minor adjustment AND the fact that I removed the snorkel from the air filter, I feel a noticeable bump in acceleration. I still feel like its slower than the older PCX but not by much. Removing the snorkel helped free up the air intake and also gave it a deeper sound which helps in traffic and overall feel for the machine.

Anyone else experience something similar?
I read somewhere that valve adjustment is not necessary for the trouble getting to it. Did you found them to be in need of adjustment?
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81tiger
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Re: 2018 Honda PCX Performance

Post by 81tiger »

The transmission gearing has changed over time.
- 2011 (125) gearing has an overall ratio of 11.27
- 2013 (150) gearing changed to a ratio of 10.55. This ratio was 6.4% taller and could better use the bump in power over the 125 engine.
- 2019 (150) gearing changed to a ratio of 9.85. This ratio is another 6.6% from the 2013 gear ratio. That would be a total of 12.6% change from 2011 a change.

Perhaps the latest changes are a bit too much as the 2019 HP may not be enough to handle the new taller gearing. Based on the comments so far, you might not be able to change enough on the vario side to help acceleration (?), you might have to change gearing if you want faster acceleration but your RPMs will go up on the top end.
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Re: 2018 Honda PCX Performance

Post by Oyabun »

OldGuywhoTinkers wrote:
CaliCal wrote:Putting their elaborate sales pitch aside, if you send an offset temperature reading to the computer and that changes the air/fuel mixture to be richer, wont that help with performance?
April 6 2018

....

Think about this: When a piston aircraft takes off, the engine is loaded and stressed to maximum. Fuel mixture is adjusted (usually manually)
by the pilot to be a "rich" mixture. Let's say it is 5:1. It needs to be left that way for 3 - 5 minutes. Why ? So that the engine can deliver
maximum power for 2 - 5 minutes. AFTER the plane is in more normal horizontal flight and gaining altitude at a normal rate, the engine is exposed to
cooler temperatures at higher altitudes, and the pilot reduces throttle and to keep from both fouling plugs and wasting fuel the pilot leans it out to some value "less rich".
Let's say it is 14:1 instead of 5:1. (That maximizes his cruising range)

Now lets begin that take off all over again from zero with a richness setting of 14:1. We now physically stress that lycoming engine to maximum with the LEAN gas mixture ratio,
and about the time that we lift off the runway, we get something called DETONATION, which means that instead of gasoline burning on each cycle of power
producing thrust, five or six of the cylinders get EXPLOSIONS, not a quick, clean burning in hundreths of a second, but EXPLOSIONS. In less than 45 seconds we now
blow holes in at least 4 of the pistons either dime sized or quarter sized, and destroy the engine. (Pistons with holes don't produce power !) The engine is destroyed and the plane goes straight down !

A similar thing can happen in either cars or motorcycles or scooters. Be VERY careful about leaning out mixtures and thinking you are so much "wiser" than the factory. I can see an alterred "super lean" mixture causing problems with a wide open throttle at 60 mph.
I know I'm a smartass, but even a dual spark Lycoming would be wetting the plugs and fail at 5:1 AFR. Maximum power is about 12.0-12.5 AFR, and richer mixtures than 11.0 are not recommended even at Take off. Anything below AFR 9 will get you landed fairly quick not in a good way. Stoich is 14.7 AFR, safe lean cruise is up to 15.6.
BTW I have PPL, flying Pipers, Cessnas and I my first training plane was a Yak-52M with an awesome Vedeneyev M-14Kh radial engine. :-)

To revert to the original question, unless you heavily modify your engine, there's no need and no point in altering the fueling. The bike has a small, narrow band O2 sensor installed and runs in closed loop most of the time - so even alteration of the CHT sensor signal would not result in much change during large part of the operation.
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Re: 2018 Honda PCX Performance

Post by Givestrong »

Hi everyone,

To add to this discussion, i tried differents solutions to modify the performance of the PCX 125 2018 (new model), because the stock acceleration is smooth but seems a bit slower than the previous model. After disassembly, i noticed that the stock rollers are 18.5g . Quite heavy for a 125.

First I bought a variator kit, made by Malossi initially for the Forza 125 and the SH 125/150, but sold as compatible for the newer PCX.
The weight of the rollers included is 10gr and there is a white and a yellow torque spring.

I tried with the recommended setting (white spring and 10gr) and the motor was running way too high in rpm, near to the limiter everytime. Great climbing performance tho.
So i ordered 11.5gr rollers, and i used the yellow torque spring (stronger). It was better, lower rpm, and good modulation of rpm depending of the degree of acceleration at the grip. Very good off the line acceleration, and good climbing performance, the bike is nervous and very nice in daily use.
But after some time, i noticed than it's hard to go faster than 105 km/h, and the wind or a slight slope drops the speed to 95-100 kmh.

So, i ordered some Honda OEM Rollers, but from the previous model, so 15g each. After that, i came back to stock variator and stock spring, but with the 15g rollers instead of the 18.5g.

The acceleration is way better than stock, near of the malossi.
The variator opens fully around 85-88 kmh, instead of 80 with the 18gr. After that, the rpm rises and it's quite responsive between 90-110, better than malossi, it holds speed better.

Consumption was 2.5l/100km with malossi and 2.4l/100km with stock+15gr. (2.2l with stock 18gr)

So, a very simple and inexpensive mod for the 2018 pcx is to use 15gr rollers, because the stock rollers are way too heavy, probably to reduce emission levels.

Sorry for the long read ! :lol:
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Re: 2018 Honda PCX Performance

Post by Oldie »

Very interesting. Was the top speed affected?
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Re: 2018 Honda PCX Performance

Post by Givestrong »

Top speed remains the same in 18 or 15gr, around 115 km/h (71mph).

I think the malossi variator ratio and the stronger torque spring are designed well for the 15hp of the forza 125, but the pcx 125 with 12hp cannot use it fully. Maybe on a PCX150, but it's not sold in France for permit reasons.

Pretty satisfied with the 15gr rollers only, next move is to find some Dr Pulley sliders for the stock variator, and see if it gains a bit of top speed.
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