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PostPosted: Wed Jun 14, 2017 9:54 pm 
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Location: Hope, BC, Canada
Year: 2014
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aguim wrote:
Problem is, there's only one (trans-mission) speed to play with on a CVT scooter. You let it
rev more freely at low vehicule speeds, and voilà it overrevs at high speeds (since it was
normally built to reach top revs at reacheable top speed).

I wouldn't fool around with these, just make sure they're properly cleaned/lubed every year or so.
(belt itself should be good for 30K -- Dave Jones is quite hard on his and has only changed it
once in 48K, so maybe 40K is possible for slower pokes like me?)


Honda says change the belt every 25,600 km, today I am at 48456 km, so I have another 2700 km to go.

I got tired of working today and talked to a few bikers at McDonalds. I dropped tools and went up the Coquihalla for a Samosa & Coffee. 120 kmph up hill and the samosa was good. Some twit dumped oil on a big bridge. Highways dumped sand and dirt all over it. What a mess but it was not slippery at least.

I changed a sprocket on my DR650 but I am not expert enough to have really noticed any difference. I have played around with tuning and I came to the conclusion that the results were not worth the efforts. Some of the factory engineers do get things right. You are always working with compromises. You increase speed but mpg decreases. You increase acceleration but reliability is compromised. Which tradeoffs do you want?

I am having more fun just riding the snot out of the Forza as it is. If I break it, I will buy something new.


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 14, 2017 10:10 pm 
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Location: Hope, BC, Canada
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I have had my Forza at 145 kmph under ideal conditions, tailwind, flat, long road BUT is the rest of motorcycle rated at 145?

Those small wheels are really spinning at that speed. Do we have a suspension rated for 145? Is the rider aware of his surroundings to safely go at this speed. And what if the little old lady pulls out to overtake the big truck.

I am too old and too worn out for that speed. Too many injuries and handicaps. Slow down and smell the asphalt. Or the cow shit if you live here.

I was recently riding bigger motorcycles at much higher speeds. I like my Forza better.


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 14, 2017 11:02 pm 
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Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2015 2:42 pm
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Location: Toronto, Canada
Year: 2015 NSS300A
Stock rollers are 21 gram or 126 total.

According to BRed's research 126 (21x6) gram total gives a 5800rpm shift point.
90 (15x6) gram total gives a 7160 rpm shift point.
Halfway between those is 108 gram total (my selection 18x6 sliders) gives a 6480 shift point. Supposedly peak torque, and fuel efficiency is 6500?
See Ed's graph...

Image

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2015 Forza 300ABS-2km 10/17/2015


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 14, 2017 11:24 pm 
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Also... Maybe Honda's engineers hands were tied by very, very strict emission standards?
I read that's why Honda went with a 279cc engine. Engines over 280cc had even more strict standards. Something to do with Euro 5 or 6 I think?

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2015 Forza 300ABS-2km 10/17/2015


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 24, 2017 3:44 am 
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Location: Carolina
Year: 2014 Forza
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A couple of runs that might be useful to those using simple single weight setups.....
these are single weight setups of various weights compared to DR Pulley 19gram sliders.


Image


Image


Several things become apparent when you isolate a series of single runs....

1) you can see that the supposedly continuously variable transmission actually produces an almost sawtooth curve showing 3 distinct peaks for almost every roller combination tested. Sliders flatten the peaks so they're less obvious.

2) with the exception of the first two seconds of each run (which is ALL clutches...more on that later), every time you see the acceleration curve turns downward, it means your rollers are moving out TOO FAST and you're losing rpm! In effect you're losing the race by wasting hard won revs.

3) each of these peaks and valleys are of short duration...a couple of seconds each at most, but every rpm change, up or down, comes complete with requisite clutch slippage....the clutch pads slip worse during major rpm changes.

4) most of those setups still have one more upshift coming....it usually occurs well after the 1/4 mile run is completed but before redline is reached.
This is true for all but the lightest of weight combinations.





for those tuning for RAW power there is a very simple mod that will almost always gain you a second or two on your 1/4 mile time....
swap out your clutch springs!

In the name of driveabilty Honda has given you a very tame clutch setup....
they don't want Granny to pee her pants when she rolls on the throttle so they use very weak springs that engage at very low rpm.

If you ridden a bike with a standard transmission, you understand....
you can creep away from a stop, or you can rev it a bit and JUMP away from a stop or you can rev it a lot and burn rubber away from a stop.
Well, to a certain extent you can do the same with your scoot (ok, you might not burn a lot of rubber, BUT you can make it jump!)

both Polini and Malossi make spring kits for the Forza's CN-250 style clutch pack.
There are several aftermarket clutches available but these require a lot of experimentation and testing to setup properly.

What I suggest is the yellow middle spring set from the Malossi clutch tuning kit.
There's a white one (lower than stock), a yellow one (125% of stock) and a red one(150% of stock)...actually 3 springs of each weight.
These resist the outward force of the clutch pad flyweights.

here are a few graphs showing just the first 2 seconds of runs comparing stock springs to Malossi yellow springs
stock springs engage at ~4400rpm yellow Malossi springs engage at~4900rpm

by engaging the clutch at higher rpm, there's less loss of revs AND you're still closer the prime power band...
the effects on speed and Gee Force is obvious

remember the color of lines through the various graphs...
they show revs, speed and Gees plotted against time and speed plotted against distance


Image

Image

Image

Image


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 12, 2017 4:22 am 
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BRed wrote:

What I suggest is the yellow middle spring set from the Malossi clutch tuning kit.
There's a white one (lower than stock), a yellow one (125% of stock) and a red one(150% of stock)...actually 3 springs of each weight.
These resist the outward force of the clutch pad flyweights.

here are a few graphs showing just the first 2 seconds of runs comparing stock springs to Malossi yellow springs
stock springs engage at ~4400rpm yellow Malossi springs engage at~4900rpm


do you think yellow malossi springs combined with 17g 23x18 drpulley sliders are better than only 17g 23x18 drpulley sliders ?


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 12, 2017 4:58 am 
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what about this

http://www.malossistore.es/maxi-delta-s ... fo300a-M-P


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